[Serusers] ser , its forks and knives, and docs, and everything else

Iqbal iqbal at gigo.co.uk
Thu Jun 16 19:11:55 CEST 2005


Hi

Another day of going back and forth, feel sorry for the poor newbie who 
might have signed up for this mailing list, and realized he'd was 
standing in no mans land between too factions who had dug deep into 
their trenches....

I cant recall the names of who posted what, and who wants what, but I 
think a summation, together with some sort of action towards an outcome, 
is really needed, so I'll try, and please add to it.

1. There is a definant call for two modes, one stable and one more fast 
paced for those who like to try out new things
    a) A mode where these two can be linked is required, someone 
suggested maintaining two threads in CVS,
    b) do you need to mailing lists, yes/no
    c) Do you need two websites yes/no
    d) Should iptel be inherently linked with SER, as most users think, 
or should their be a non-biased site, I think since SER has its own 
name, why not use something based upon that, just as other opensource 
has, if companies wish to sponser, add there name etc, then they should 
be allowed by the maintainers discretion

2. Documentation, yes it is poor, but that means it can only get better 
, or at least the way I look at it,
    a)Who maintains it, is there a overwhelming need for help on this, 
if so, can we not on the website above, include a link for those who 
would like to help contribute, and then set some standards as to how it 
needs to be done etc
    b) Informal documentation, I think sites such as onsip etc have 
started something good, and many users will eventually have their own 
websites etc, with tips and tricks, however if this could also be added 
to in one place it would be good for the newbie, maybe a wiki, maybe onsip.

3. Working together, now this is a tricky one, since no matter how we 
look at it, SER seems to be splitting (unless I am misreading the 
posts), which means even in theory if we want to make it work like i 
did, its just wont, and we need to accept that, its growing and people 
want/wish to do it there way, and I guess the compromise is in 1, above. 
No matter how many emails go back and forth, going back to what it was 
is not possible, cause human nature will not allow it.

4. Justification and blame, well I think alot of that has happened, and 
as a user, since I dont know all the details I cannot really comment, 
except to say, that I am sure its all justified, and everyone is too 
blame :-), but its time too move on, it was a project and like all 
projects starts a little chaotically, and somewhere down the line a 
radical shake up needs to be done, this also happens in companies, trust 
me I have built quite a few, the casual working modes are dropped for a 
formal approach, suddenly hand written scraps of paper are no longer 
acceptable, everything needs to have 3 signatures on it...such is life. 
I guess this is what SER is going through, and maybe this is what it 
needs, who's fault it is, or who realized a change is required is 
irrelevant, but without change I think SER will not work, simply because 
some of the core team want a change, and you cannot argue with that. 
Soooo write down what is needed take a vote, ask a few users what they 
think, and lets get it done.

As a side note, I hope the above doesn't seem biased one way or the 
other, it is not meant to, its meant to get things moving and a decision 
reached, before everyone goes on holiday, and starts smoking a pipe of 
peace....without having invited me.

Iqbal






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